Minus Russian propaganda, what's the real story on the Ukraine?

[ism22]

[QUOTE=Paddo Colt 61;n965683]

I wonder who sabotaged the gas line between Russia and Germany?

What's your gut feeling on it Edwin? I'll grant you time to consult the Tele or Sky news before you reply, or maybe your mate -Ism has thoughts on the matter?

Izzy, who rails against Russian "war crimes" while conveniently overlooking the fact that as we write the US, in league with its freedom loving ally Saudi Arabia, is bombing the bejeezus out of The Yemen - now there's a real war crime that the Western MSM, if they weren't just compliant stenographers, could get their teeth into. An illegal invasion against a country that won't comply with the US's "rules based order". Rule No.1 - Do as we say or we'll kick your head in!

Honestly... who lives in the free, developed, democratic world and acts as if it's worse than a bloody dictatorship?

My dad and my wife both escaped dictatorships. Neither are as forgiving as you towards the actions of such regimes.

PS - learn to quote... I know you're the smartest in the room so am confused as to why you deleted the closed square bracket after Eddy's name. Hint... so long as all the brackets are complete, you won't have issues with quotes!!

[eddie]

PS - learn to quote... I know you're the smartest in the room so am confused as to why you deleted the closed square bracket after Eddy's name. Hint... so long as all the brackets are complete, you won't have issues with quotes!!

Good question.
It makes threads like this one harder to read, having to work out who said what.
My gut feeling is he does it on purpose!
You can picture him painstakingly deleting those brackets just to prove he doesn't obey the mechanics of this website.
Colt is an immature little kid at heart.

[A Country Member]

Honestly... who lives in the free, developed, democratic world and acts as if it's worse than a bloody dictatorship?

My dad and my wife both escaped dictatorships. Neither are as forgiving as you towards the actions of such regimes.

Which dictatorship did your father escape?

[ism22]

Good question.
It makes threads like this one harder to read, having to work out who said what.
My gut feeling is he does it on purpose!
You can picture him painstakingly deleting those brackets just to prove he doesn't obey the mechanics of this website.
Colt is an immature little kid at heart.

Nailed it. Bet he's just doing it to screw with my tiny brain... gaaaaah!

[Rooster1908]

[QUOTE=ism22;n965709]

Honestly... who lives in the free, developed, democratic world and acts as if it's worse than a bloody dictatorship?

My dad and my wife both escaped dictatorships. Neither are as forgiving as you towards the actions of such regimes.

PS - learn to quote... I know you're the smartest in the room so am confused as to why you deleted the closed square bracket after Eddy's name. Hint... so long as all the brackets are complete, you won't have issues with quotes!!

Maybe he doesn't live here .

[mightyrooster]

Good question.
It makes threads like this one harder to read, having to work out who said what.
My gut feeling is he does it on purpose!
You can picture him painstakingly deleting those brackets just to prove he doesn't obey the mechanics of this website.
Colt is an immature little kid at heart.

Uh oh Eddie. You said gut feeling again. I ‘feel’ another lecture coming on.

[Random Rooster]

Anyone remember when Vlad stated that the invasion of Ukraine as a 'special military operation' to 'denazify' and 'demilitarize' Ukraine?? I think he may have fallen short....by plenty

[eddie]

Uh oh Eddie. You said gut feeling again. I ‘feel’ another lecture coming on.

Yep, I did it on purpose...........like a red rag to a bull.
I guess I can be a bit immature myself.

But dw. He wont (miss) quote my post.
He never replies when people question his silly abuse of the quote function.

[Paddo Colt 61]

Hey Random (Randy). This piece was written back in 2014. After the coup and during the time that Nazi groups began terrorising the Donbass and other regions in the East.


A silent coup has taken place in Washington and rampant militarism now rules.

Why do we tolerate the threat of another world war in our name? Why do we allow lies that justify this risk? The scale of our indoctrination, wrote Harold Pinter, is a “brilliant, even witty, highly successful act of hypnosis”, as if the truth “never happened even while it was happening”.

Every year the American historian William Blum publishes his “updated summary of the record of U.S. foreign policy” which shows that, since 1945, the U.S. has tried to overthrow more than 50 governments, many of them democratically elected; grossly interfered in elections in 30 countries; bombed the civilian populations of 30 countries; used chemical and biological weapons; and attempted to assassinate foreign leaders.

In many cases Britain has been a collaborator. The degree of human suffering, let alone criminality, is little acknowledged in the west, despite the presence of the world’s most advanced communications and nominally most free journalism. That the most numerous victims of terrorism – “our” terrorism – are Muslims, is unsayable. That extreme jihadism, which led to 9/11, was nurtured as a weapon of Anglo-American policy (Operation Cyclone in Afghanistan) is suppressed. In April the U.S. state department noted that, following Nato’s campaign in 2011, “Libya has become a terrorist safe haven“.

The name of “our” enemy has changed over the years, from communism to Islamism, but generally it is any society independent of western power and occupying strategically useful or resource-rich territory, or merely offering an alternative to U.S. domination.

The leaders of these obstructive nations are usually violently shoved aside, such as the democrats Muhammad Mossedeq in Iran, Jacobo Arbenz in Guatemala and Salvador Allende in Chile, or they are murdered like Patrice Lumumba in the Democratic Republic of Congo. All are subjected to a western media campaign of vilification – think Fidel Castro, Hugo Chávez, now Vladimir Putin.

“If Putin can be provoked into coming to their aid, his pre-ordained ‘pariah’ role will justify a Nato-run guerrilla war that is likely to spill into Russia itself.”

Washington’s role in Ukraine is different only in its implications for the rest of us. For the first time since the Reagan years, the U.S. is threatening to take the world to war. With eastern Europe and the Balkans now military outposts of Nato, the last “buffer state” bordering Russia – Ukraine – is being torn apart by fascist forces unleashed by the U.S. and the EU. We in the west are now backing neo-Nazis in a country where Ukrainian Nazis backed Hitler.

Having masterminded the coup in February against the democratically elected government in Kiev, Washington’s planned seizure of Russia’s historic, legitimate warm-water naval base in Crimea failed. The Russians defended themselves, as they have done against every threat and invasion from the west for almost a century.

But Nato’s military encirclement has accelerated, along with U.S.-orchestrated attacks on ethnic Russians in Ukraine. If Putin can be provoked into coming to their aid, his pre-ordained “pariah” role will justify a Nato-run guerrilla war that is likely to spill into Russia itself.

Instead, Putin has confounded the war party by seeking an accommodation with Washington and the EU, by withdrawing Russian troops from the Ukrainian border and urging ethnic Russians in eastern Ukraine to abandon the weekend’s provocative referendum.

These Russian-speaking and bilingual people – a third of Ukraine’s population – have long sought a democratic federation that reflects the country’s ethnic diversity and is both autonomous of Kiev and independent of Moscow. Most are neither “separatists” nor “rebels”, as the western media calls them, but citizens who want to live securely in their homeland.

Like the ruins of Iraq and Afghanistan, Ukraine has been turned into a C.I.A. theme park – run personally by C.I.A. director John Brennan in Kiev, with dozens of “special units” from the C.I.A. and F.B.I. setting up a “security structure” that oversees savage attacks on those who opposed the February coup. Watch the videos, read the eye-witness reports from the massacre in Odessa this month. Bussed fascist thugs burned the trade union headquarters, killing 41 people trapped inside. Watch the police standing by.

A doctor described trying to rescue people, “but I was stopped by pro-Ukrainian Nazi radicals. One of them pushed me away rudely, promising that soon me and other Jews of Odessa are going to meet the same fate. What occurred yesterday didn’t even take place during the fascist occupation in my town in world war two. I wonder, why the whole world is keeping silent.” [see footnote]

Russian-speaking Ukrainians are fighting for survival. When Putin announced the withdrawal of Russian troops from the border, the Kiev junta’s defence secretary, Andriy Parubiy – a founding member of the fascist Svoboda party – boasted that attacks on “insurgents” would continue. In Orwellian style, propaganda in the west has inverted this to Moscow “trying to orchestrate conflict and provocation“, according to William Hague. His cynicism is matched by Obama’s grotesque congratulations to the coup junta on its “remarkable restraint” after the Odessa massacre. The junta, says Obama, is “duly elected”. As Henry Kissinger once said: “It is not a matter of what is true that counts, but what is perceived to be true.”

In the U.S. media the Odessa atrocity has been played down as “murky” and a “tragedy” in which “nationalists” (neo-Nazis) attacked “separatists” (people collecting signatures for a referendum on a federal Ukraine). Rupert Murdoch’s Wall Street Journal damned the victims – “Deadly Ukraine Fire Likely Sparked by Rebels, Government Says“. Propaganda in Germany has been pure cold war, with the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung warning its readers of Russia’s “undeclared war”. For the Germans, it is a poignant irony that Putin is the only leader to condemn the rise of fascism in 21st-century Europe.

A popular truism is that “the world changed” following 9/11. But what has changed? According to the great whistleblower Daniel Ellsberg, a silent coup has taken place in Washington and rampant militarism now rules. The Pentagon currently runs “special operations” – secret wars – in 124 countries. At home, rising poverty and a loss of liberty are the historic corollary of a perpetual war state. Add the risk of nuclear war, and the question is: why do we tolerate this?


John Pilger


+ posts
John Pilger has twice won Britain’s highest award for journalism and has been International Reporter of the Year, News Reporter of the Year and Descriptive Writer of the Year.He has made 61 documentary films and has won an Emmy, a BAFTA the Royal Television Society prize and the Sydney Peace Prize. His ‘Cambodia Year Zero’ is named as one of the ten most important films of the 20th century.

[Paddo Colt 61]

[QUOTE=A Country Member; Which dictatorship did your father escape?

Intriguing development isn't it from Freedom Boy? The USA? Nah ...that seems to be a working mans's paradise where a man is freely thanked for his/her service in the incessant wars that are a feature of life and the lifeblood of the economy.

Could be an escape from the Cult of the Fisher Folk (the Asian branch of our own Shooters & Fishers). I do hear, though, that the Fisher Folk can sit around in Commie Vietnam whingeing about and criticising the government with anyone who happens along including Aussie craft beer drunks so that doesn't sound all that totalitarian.

No, they must have escaped from the planet Souffsidni and the evil clutches of Galaxy Fuhrer Hashtag Von Dribbler whom, I believe, persecuted craft beer drinkers and anyone associated with the revolutionary fishing fraternity - The RFF, a proscribed terrorist outfit whose sitting around drinking alcohol and mouthing off incoherently posed, according to the Dictatorship, a threat to "public order" - yeah, right, typical Commie (or its space equivalent) assault on freedom.
Splashing down not far from Fukushima, they found a New Jerusalem, one where craft beer flowed from every crevice delighting the journeymen from afar. Free at last, free at last....Great God Almighty....they were free at last.

End of Chapter One. To be continued,,,,,,,,,,,

[Andrew Walker]

[QUOTE=Paddo Colt 61;n965796][QUOTE=A Country Member; Which dictatorship did your father escape?

Intriguing development isn't it from Freedom Boy? The USA? Nah ...that seems to be a working mans's paradise where a man is freely thanked for his/her service in the incessant wars that are a feature of life and the lifeblood of the economy.

Could be an escape from the Cult of the Fisher Folk (the Asian branch of our own Shooters & Fishers). I do hear, though, that the Fisher Folk can sit around in Commie Vietnam whingeing about and criticising the government with anyone who happens along including Aussie craft beer drunks so that doesn't sound all that totalitarian.

No, they must have escaped from the planet Souffsidni and the evil clutches of Galaxy Fuhrer Hashtag Von Dribbler whom, I believe, persecuted craft beer drinkers and anyone associated with the revolutionary fishing fraternity - The RFF, a proscribed terrorist outfit whose sitting around drinking alcohol and mouthing off incoherently posed, according to the Dictatorship, a threat to "public order" - yeah, right, typical Commie (or its space equivalent) assault on freedom.
Splashing down not far from Fukushima, they found a New Jerusalem, one where craft beer flowed from every crevice delighting the journeymen from afar. Free at last, free at last....Great God Almighty....they were free at last.

End of Chapter One. To be continued,,,,,,,,,,,[/QUOTE]

LOL This PC is why I really like you.

[A Country Member]

How bout the Green post before?
Must’ve been for using the N word

[Paddo Colt 61]

No but just as bad, a John Pilger article from 2014. Available on johnmenadue.com. Cripes...not a lot of freedom round here it seems.

[King Salvo]

[QUOTE=Paddo Colt 61;n928239][QUOTE=Johnny Brass; Congratulations on a new low Paddo for slinging crap on the Anzacs.....

Not slinging anything at the Anzacs, just slinging it at myth makers especially when the myth is designed to encourage people to think of themselves as citizens of a warrior nation which in turn feeds into the obscene expenditure on "Defence" and the willingness to invade other countries on behalf of the most bellicose nation on Earth. It was no accident that the former copper Dutton yesterday warned that we had to prepare for war and Smoko drew the red line at the Solomons. War with China? Really? The populous archipelago to our north has no problem with China and nor should we but the US has.

What about some truths about the yokels who traipsed off to war on Britain's behalf all those years ago when the country was Anglo - Irish? Did you know for example that the 1st AIF had the highest rate of desertion in the British Army. In all, more than 22, 000 deserted over the course of the war, many of them forming armed gangs which terrorised French villagers.

Mortified by the situation, Tory politicians here at home agreed with the British army's call for the death penalty which uniquely did not apply to Australian volunteers even in the case of desertion. Enlistment had all but collapsed as casualty figures ballooned and no doubt would have not picked up if Australians were shooting Australians.

After the war many men enlisted in a British expeditionary force which invaded revolutionary Russia on the side of the old aristocracy, killing ordinary Russians much like themselves one would think. Many other men returned to the Fascist RSL out of which came the reactionary paramilitary White Armies organised by the officer class and spent the 20s and 30s rioting and beating up Trade Unionists. Tories who opposed the building of the Sydney harbour Bridge during the Depression encouraged White Army elements to invade the opening ceremony in 1932 to deprive the "Socialists", who built it, of the glory.

We, or more appropriately right wing Australia, has used the Anzac myth for all it's worth and people need to be conscious of that.



[/QUOTE]

Comrade Paddo when are you enlisting in Little Legs Putin's army of the unwilling - sign up for 12 months and survive and you are rewarded with Russian Federation Citizenship

[Paddo Colt 61]

Chapter 2 : The Freedom Riders.

Having assumed human form after camping in the transformative effusions of the Fukiyama site, our hapless trio is ferried by a group of drunken Fishermen to China and then to the ominously named Information Centre of the People. The following is a transcript of their interview.

The Father: look we've come a long way in our escape to freedom and I've got a laundry list here of the things that are non negotiable....

The Commissar: Shoot, it's my pleasure to answer every question truthfully but look, it's all pretty much documented world wide.

The Father + the Son: Will we have the freedom to go to the footy and follow our own team? Go to the beach? Lie on the couch watching telly? Go fishing? Make our own craft beer? Natter with the blokes at the pub? Go to the footy? Be free from the scourge of unemployment and poverty?

The Commissar: It's a yes to all of that sir.

The Boys: Okaaaay. Well here's one for ya, we brought a bit of coin and business moxy with us from Souffsidni and we wanna get richer so do we have the freedom to start a business, maybe a big one, make billions and pollute and desecrate the environment, pay low wages and never give thought to the generation that can't afford a house deposit?

The Comm: Pretty much yes to that, we are Capitalist here but Capital doesn't run the joint so your business will be taxed assiduously. There'll be no lurks. perks, extravagant subsidies, tax dodges or price gouging but I'll give yez a tip, if that's what you're after, There's this place called Australia........

Dad: No...no....first things first. Do we see a free media here?

The Comm: To an extent..in fact we've modeled our media on Australian best practice. The media is free to report on the footy (all sport really), Celebrities are widely promoted which is much appreciated. Advertisements designed to encourage you to gamble and for lots of junk that you'll never use make up most of the content. Politics is the least popular, the people don't wanna know really, but we do publish the Government's views or those of the Security Services just about exclusively and we find that propaganda is lapped up. Jeez the viewers work themselves into lather over things they know nothing about. They wanna go to war and everything else.

The Trio: Mmmmmmm............what did our Earthling relative Izzy mean by freedom then. What's he whining about? Could it be the freedom to be poor and hungry, to have an unaffordable roof over our heads? To be free to knock back free healthcare from cradle to grave and free education and affordable accommodation and transport?

We leave the trio now pondering the meaning of freedom according to some. Will they continue to echo Issy's "give me freedom or give me death!" - a highly likely outcome - or will they, as seems possible but probably not likely, think on it a bit more?

To be continued..........