Let's get the Facts Right on China.

[A Country Member]

Implicitly trust the media
* Just not when it relates to the Chooks

[King Salvo]

Ha ha ha! What values? Please list them and enlighten me. I'll start you off- invading other Nations since the Maori Wars and murdering the innocent in every one of them having gathered valuable work experience here at home on the indigenous.

You mean China/Soviet Union/Russia/North Korea/Vietnam/Cambodia/Cuba -yes they were certainly big on ethnic cleansing and executing / jailing and deporting folk to the numerous work/re-education camps that existed in their Various GULAG systems

[A Country Member]

You mean China/Soviet Union/Russia/North Korea/Vietnam/Cambodia/Cuba -yes they were certainly big on ethnic cleansing and executing / jailing and deporting folk to the numerous work/re-education camps that existed in their Various GULAG systems

Sounds very much like the colonial Britain and the birth of Aus Kling

[Jacks Fur Coat]

Sounds very much like the colonial Britain and the birth of Aus Kling

Wow. Scary to think these thoughts mingle amongst us.

Oz is probably the greatest success story in terms of a quick maturity and acceptance of a myriad of cultures and backgrounds.

Comparing to countries (much older) who still practice human rights abuse is mindblowing.

If (any other nation) aside from Brits had settled on this wide brown land God knows what would have become of the indigenous through recent history. Certainly no honour and rep in academia, legal, sports, politics, welcome to countries, special days, etc. Like now somewhat deified.

If ignorance was bliss Skeez, you'd be a blizzard.

[zac]

That is true Zac. I guess I have no issue with someone expressing their views, but draw the line at the continual bagging of our western society and values. Maybe a one off comment but not incessant threads and links to fringe websites spreading dangerous ideology. I dont think BB knocked his own country or values?

Big diff. Esp from a non Rooster supporting troll with only
one agenda that the King captures brilliantly. As I've said numerous times, he has no place here.

but i don't think he's non rooster supporting. true, he doesn't hate souths but that's showing his vintage - the souths hating is a more recent thing. true he doesn't live or die by easts winning but people have their own way of following footy. and he is a roosters junior and some of his posts about the social history of the roosters and pre-gentrified paddo have been top class. he's not typical of the old paddo but he's very much a product of it. his extreme politics is probably a reaction against the anti-intellectualism and racism of the day.- in 1960 the bulletin magazine had 'australia for the white man' on its banner.

i don't think you can ban people you disagree with. the way he could be banned is for having two accounts. don't know what the mods position on that is - the rule was probably made to stop people from being banned coming back. if they want to use that rule they should tell him to pick one account or be banned

[Paddo Colt 61]

Dangerous ideas? Please explain. Former PMs express similar " anti Western"views. In fact, most of the world does. It's about not being enmeshed in the interests of a hegemon. There's a new word for it - Sub Imperialist, a nation which subjects its own national interests to the interests of the Imperial power, Other words are client state, Lap Dog or most aptly, Running Dog.

Contrary to the cancel ravings of Kingsley I have never advocated for Communism to be a system of governance appropriate to Oz, a country where the working class has been, mostly, relatively comfortable and affluent thanks to the power of Trade Unions in our past but that is changing in our NeoCon world of the present.

There has also been, since the Russian Revolution, an active and ubiquitous anti Communist agenda pushed relentlessly by the Oz power elite an integral part of which is the privately owned conservative MSM. We were quick off the mark to send a contingent to Russia in 1919 to help restore the aristocracy and we were one of the few nations that attempted to ban the Communist Party. All the while our rulers have begged to be part of any anti Communist proxy war engineered by the US.

All of that has not been the spontaneous demand of the Australian people which, despite all of the early Cold War horror stories propagated by the US and Britain and relayed by the MSM at the time, declined, in a referendum, to ban the Communist Party. Nevertheless a very high proportion of our population clearly believe that anything seemingly official is holy writ, not concocted from political bias and, is somehow an undeniable truism. Clearly such people are not thinkers and we see their mental capacity on show in the TV ratings. Jaxie is proudly one of their number as is the dressing gown and slippers, old before his time, BB.

My humble and consequently irrelevant position is that we could and should be neutral like NZ. Common sense should dictate that we are so far away from the rest of the world that neutrality is a no brainer. We are not front of mind for any nation in the world. The posturing and the enormous expense is all done for the domestic political purposes of the conservative ruling elite which relies on fear to maintain its power. Since the get go they have presented us with boogie men (mostly Chinese) and that frightened 50% are still buying it.

[Random Rooster]

NZ hasn't exactly been neutral towards China in recent years. However yes i agree Australia should tread warily when it comes to a country that has played a major role in making us the greatest place to live on earth

https://www.rand.org/blog/2022/12/ne...-to-china.html

[Paddo Colt 61]

I would hesitate to put much store in that article Randy. The Rand Corp is charged with advising on the thrust of US foreign policy going forward.

He begins by implying that NZ is falling into a hawkish line re China but the final paragraphs qualify what, in reality, is wishful thinking.

No doubt US and Australian "Intelligence" has been busy undermining Arden and Labor by any means available but neutrality is popular in NZ. They're smarter than we are.

[Jacks Fur Coat]

but i don't think he's non rooster supporting. true, he doesn't hate souths but that's showing his vintage - the souths hating is a more recent thing. true he doesn't live or die by easts winning but people have their own way of following footy. and he is a roosters junior and some of his posts about the social history of the roosters and pre-gentrified paddo have been top class. he's not typical of the old paddo but he's very much a product of it. his extreme politics is probably a reaction against the anti-intellectualism and racism of the day.- in 1960 the bulletin magazine had 'australia for the white man' on its banner.

i don't think you can ban people you disagree with. the way he could be banned is for having two accounts. don't know what the mods position on that is - the rule was probably made to stop people from being banned coming back. if they want to use that rule they should tell him to pick one account or be banned

Thanks Zac, a considered response. But you may misunderstand me.

I'm not saying he should be banned for supporting Souths or disagreeing with me per se. (although now you mention it...)

Its for repeated same theme agenda pushing. Clear as day, and a breach of forum rules.

[Paddo Colt 61]

What same theme agenda pushing? Critical of Western foreign policy? You'd have the job in front of you demonstrating that is an agenda. FYI Jax, an agenda for the purpose of this site might be Anti Vax or the anti Fluoride campaign or urging readers to join the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers ( all issues close to your own heart no doubt). Geopolitics is an issue that's up for discussion everywhere but Sky and that's what has confused you.

Likewise Patriotism is nowhere near universally shared in this country, there's too much of a feeling that it is distorted for partisan political advantage. Fortunately, we have the grotesque example of the USA as far as that is concerned.

[King Salvo]

Keep digging that hole Comrade Paddo as you never know you may end up in China.

[zac]

Thanks Zac, a considered response. But you may misunderstand me.

I'm not saying he should be banned for supporting Souths or disagreeing with me per se. (although now you mention it...)

Its for repeated same theme agenda pushing. Clear as day, and a breach of forum rules.

that's what i understood you to mean - like i said to salvo, one person's agenda pushing is another's arguing a case.

it's not right to ban posters for arguing a case because you don't agree with it. would you call for a poster to be banned if he regularly made posts that matched your politics?

[King Salvo]

Not sure how you can ever say Comrade Paddo is arguing a case when he is incapable of engaging in any type of real discussion or debate at all.

It is clear to most that he has an anti west/capitalism agenda as every single post has that same theme repeated ad nauseum.

Of course you also often see the temper tantrum reactions from Comrade Paddo when he derides folk for having different opinions - the old we are Sheepies/Fools/ Idiots/Ning Nongs/ Dim Whit's/MSN Brainwashed and of course the character assassinations etc etc.

The opinion of the "smartest person in the room" that Comrade Paddo has of himself is not the case because actually he is definitely in the wrong room.

[Jacks Fur Coat]

that's what i understood you to mean - like i said to salvo, one person's agenda pushing is another's arguing a case.

it's not right to ban posters for arguing a case because you don't agree with it. would you call for a poster to be banned if he regularly made posts that matched your politics?

Rules are there for a reason regardless of what you or I think of them.

If what he has done to this forum in recent years is not agenda pushing, then what is?

[zac]

there's no political requirement for the pen. if anything it's an opportunity to hear 'what the other half thinks'. other people posting things which you don't politically agree with is inevitable and it's best to not get upset about it. read off topic stuff if you want, participate if you want, just stay in the footy section if you want.

so long as people don't flood the main section with politics then i don't think you can say that they're pushing an agenda in a way that interferes with the chookpen's core function.