Sport and Pokies

[stephenj]

q and a was very good with wilkie explaining a lot last night, im now a bit iof a supporter of his efforts!

[Guest]

If the government was serious about tackling gambling additions, then why is it just concentrating on the pokies, other than the fact that's what that fool Wilkie has insisted on. There are various forms of gambling just as addictive as the pokies - horse betting for one.

I've never been a fan of pokies myself, although I'd have the occasional dabble when I was younger and they still had a lever rather than just the buttons they had nowdays. And I still remember they gave my mother hours of pleasure as she put her bags and bags of 5c through the machines. And then as soon as she got a decent win she'd cash it in and walk away, knowing it was only downhill from there. Our family had quite a few extras at Xmas and birthdays due to Mum's wins on the pokies, as that's what she'd do with her 'ill gotten gains', spend it on extras for us.

And what comes after legislating you must make a pre-commitment regarding how much you spend the pokies, a pre-commitment on how much you can drink or smoke of a night?? Please!!

As has been said time and time again, you cannot legislate to control idiocy, it is an impossibility.

NC

Wow - your Mum bucked the trend and became the only winning player in poker machine history?

No

Mum would tell you kids about the wins, but not the times when those bags and bags of coins stayed in the machine

Here's a good article;

http://www.thepunch.com.au/articles/...ing-addiction/

[Spanner in the works]

I think you just outed yourself as a Q&A contributor.

It's true isn't it?

[Guest]

This is my take on the issue..

[novice chook]

Wow - your Mum bucked the trend and became the only winning player in poker machine history?

No

Mum would tell you kids about the wins, but not the times when those bags and bags of coins stayed in the machine

Here's a good article;

http://www.thepunch.com.au/articles/...ing-addiction/

Mate she played with 5c coins and would pull out $100 to $200 at a time with remarkable regularity, so I reckon she be one of few who did actually come out in front. That's because she would walk away when she was losing (no fun she reckoned) and when she was winning.

NC

[Guest]

My thoughts exactly. If you need to dupe the mindless masses into making donations through poker machines to stop your business failing then you should not even be in business.

What's the difference between the gamblers and alcoholics ? Aside that the gamblers bring in a better revenue stream ?

[bondi-boy]

Wilkie...no clue whatsoever.

He's changed his mind several times on this issue ... first it was all pokies, now it's not all of them but only the higher amount each bet ones.
Players have to register, produce 100 points if ID to get a card, and set a voluntary limit [that can be changed at any time?]
I'm sure I read somewhere that players have to give their bank account details and the govt can look in their bank account.


. Swapped cards?
. Loaned cards?
. Sold cards?

[Guest]

It's true isn't it?

There are several dozen pokies in Easts leagues. There weren't as many in the 70s when Ron Jones ran the club.

So yes.

[Guest]

What's the difference between the gamblers and alcoholics ? Aside that the gamblers bring in a better revenue stream ?

True but to be honest I have no trouble with gambling per se. It is human nature to gamble. The British tried to get the local Chinese population in Hong Kong to give it away and quicky realized it was impossible. Humans need vice. My problem with poker machines is that they are a sucker bet. It is a computer programmed to take your money. The flashing lights make it exciting while the occasional payout springs hope eternal. I think it is the kind of gambling where you have very little chance of winning anything much $20, $50, $500 - all chump change while making contributions to the thing on a regular basis. Of course Big Mike you and I are smart enough to know this but many people are not. I mean even a punt on the horses brings your own knowledge and skill into the equation somewhat. For me I just can't get past the fact that it is a computer programmed to take peoples money and people are happy to play the things.

[bondi-boy]

There seems not to be as many people in the Leagues club these days either...as there were back in the Jones day.

There's no bistro anymore...bad idea IMO.

Not as many patrons, not as much revenue from pokies or anything else.

[Guest]

I was in Las Vegas back in 1992, two things happened.

1. I played my first and last spin of a slot machine, and won $5000

2. Frank Sinatra saved my life.

I was being beaten up by two guys in the underground car park of the then open Sands. Frank Sinatra came down from his office and said.

"Johnny, Nunzio, that's enough"

[bondi-boy]

True but to be honest I have no trouble with gambling per se. It is human nature to gamble. The British tried to get the local Chinese population in Hong Kong to give it away and quicky realized it was impossible. Humans need vice. My problem with poker machines is that they are a sucker bet. It is a computer programmed to take your money. The flashing lights make it exciting while the occasional payout springs hope eternal. I think it is the kind of gambling where you have very little chance of winning anything much $20, $50, $500 - all chump change while making contributions to the thing on a regular basis. Of course Big Mike you and I are smart enough to know this but many people are not. I mean even a punt on the horses brings your own knowledge and skill into the equation somewhat. For me I just can't get past the fact that it is a computer programmed to take peoples money and people are happy to play the things.

Poker machines in NSW return 92% of the gambled money to the players over each month.

Keno, horses, trots, dogs, sports betting etc returns from 14.25% to 25% max, so Hadley allegedly said today...anyway, it was nowhere near as much of a return to the gamblers as poker machines.

He'll repeat the figures tomorrow or soon, I'll try and get the exact figures for each type of betting.

[stsae]

Poker machines in NSW return 92% of the gambled money to the players over each month.

Keno, horses, trots, dogs, sports betting etc returns from 14.25% to 25% max, so Hadley allegedly said today...anyway, it was nowhere near as much of a return to the gamblers as poker machines.

He'll repeat the figures tomorrow or soon, I'll try and get the exact figures for each type of betting.

This is from the wife, she's worked in hospitality accounting for years.

Average they work on is 80-85% return to punters and the rest goes to the venues. That's for the lifetime of the machines. And that's averaged out, different machines are set differently. Monthly is a selective way to look at the issue.

It's that 15-20% profit the venues will be caned on tax wise.

Currently in QLD pay approx 40% tax on profit and NSW approx 30% tax on profit.


I'm not a pokie player. But I love a game of poker.

[Headless Chook]

Poker machines in NSW return 92% of the gambled money to the players over each month.

Keno, horses, trots, dogs, sports betting etc returns from 14.25% to 25% max, so Hadley allegedly said today...anyway, it was nowhere near as much of a return to the gamblers as poker machines.

He'll repeat the figures tomorrow or soon, I'll try and get the exact figures for each type of betting.

Pokies have to be set so they return a minimum of 86% back to the punter. Some pubs and clubs will set the limits higher, others will keep it at the base rate.

[Guest]

True but to be honest I have no trouble with gambling per se. It is human nature to gamble. The British tried to get the local Chinese population in Hong Kong to give it away and quicky realized it was impossible. Humans need vice. My problem with poker machines is that they are a sucker bet. It is a computer programmed to take your money. The flashing lights make it exciting while the occasional payout springs hope eternal. I think it is the kind of gambling where you have very little chance of winning anything much $20, $50, $500 - all chump change while making contributions to the thing on a regular basis. Of course Big Mike you and I are smart enough to know this but many people are not. I mean even a punt on the horses brings your own knowledge and skill into the equation somewhat. For me I just can't get past the fact that it is a computer programmed to take peoples money and people are happy to play the things.

I totally agree with you, and i am by no means a fan of pokie machines. My gripe with this whole notion is that the government is getting manipulated by the minority who cannot help themselves.

I'd rather them leave this issue for the time being and try and fix the alcohol problem, which in my opinion is spiraling out of control. I am astounded by how many people choose to obliterate themselves at least once a week. Lookng at the future generations - the problem is only getting worse.

Unlike problem gamblers (who do enough damage to themselves and their loved ones), alcohol affects not only the persons surrounding circle of kin but random, average people who they may have never met (assaults, etc).

As harsh as this sounds, i do not care for a person that chooses to self-destruct. It's sad to see, but to me, the person is as good as gone. It's up to them to get out of the hole they dug.

What pisses me off is when i see innocent people get caught up negatively in an act, perpertrated by a dope who can't help himself when drinking.