How important is research?

[Guest]

Hey guys. I want to tell you a story from a year ago. I was hanging out some mates of mine, one of whom played a few games in the roosters lower grades about 5 yrs ago(whom I will not name). I was telling them him although we had lost the grandfinal we had snared a major coup in the shape of Anthony Watts.

Straight away, he told me that he would screw up our club because he had played along side him and had seen what a big tosser he is. Then I looked up a few articles and found that he had been kicked out of cronulla for "attitude problems".

I was just wondering whether our club does any research on a player's attitude when they go looking to spend there hundreds of thousands and risk the reputation of our great club.

I've grown up all my life supporting the roosters and I think we need to have a grading system where we give a player a mark out of 50 for ability and 50 for attitude and add the two to see their overall mark out of 100. Had the managment had bothered asking any of the former lower grade coaches about Watts's attitude problems , we could had potentially saved thousands of dollars not to mention the crap we were thrown into. If were truely looking for a "New Begining " and a "New attitude" this is surely the way we should be going.

[stsae]

Why was Watts let go from this club originally???

Look at Pezzdispenser and Bwaiff, great blokes off the field, fan favs.

But are they good enough on the field???

Will they win you a comp???

There is a school of thought that often the player with the bit of carnt in him is often the more determined player therefore the winner. The nice guys finish last theory.

Not always the case I will admit.

But so often I've been told by people who get the chance to meet their "heroes" that they leave that meeting very underwhelmed.

A classic example is Andrew Johns. I've never met him but everyone I know that has to a man, and woman, say he is a prize carnt. Great footballer prick of a human.

And often with blokes like Mozz for example, many think from their on field reps that off the field they will be low humans. But from everyone I know whose met the big man, they say he is an absolute gentleman.

I don't know if your rating system would work but I do know we may struggle to find a really competitive squad without a few arseholes. Sad but true IMO.

[Waylander]

Watt's history was well known by the club. He was kicked out by us before he went to Cronulla. The pertinent facts were these:

1. By all reports he had cleaned up his act in Townsville and was being well behaved and professional.
2. He was playing good football, but was unlikely to break permanently into the Cowboys starting side.
3. He came relatively cheaply.
4. We were desperate for a quick fix (as usual), to a percieved short-coming in the roster.

In essence, he was considered worth a chance. Management gambled, just as they did with Carney (both Todd and Justin). Every recruitment decision is a gamble to one degree or another. No-one can gaurantee a players form from year to year (I bet Parra were grinning big-time when they signed Justin Poore). And in some cases, there attitude is just as volatile.

Research is vital, and it IS done, but neither is it the whole story.

[Guest]

Why was Watts let go from this club originally???

Look at Pezzdispenser and Bwaiff, great blokes off the field, fan favs.

But are they good enough on the field???

Will they win you a comp???

There is a school of thought that often the player with the bit of carnt in him is often the more determined player therefore the winner. The nice guys finish last theory.

Not always the case I will admit.

But so often I've been told by people who get the chance to meet their "heroes" that they leave that meeting very underwhelmed.

A classic example is Andrew Johns. I've never met him but everyone I know that has to a man, and woman, say he is a prize carnt. Great footballer prick of a human.

And often with blokes like Mozz for example, many think from their on field reps that off the field they will be low humans. But from everyone I know whose met the big man, they say he is an absolute gentleman.

I don't know if your rating system would work but I do know we may struggle to find a really competitive squad without a few arseholes. Sad but true IMO.

Good points in that. However by attitude I don't just mean whether they are personally good guys or not, attitude includes things like commitment to club, consistency at training, and not putting your needs before the club and acting selfishly.

Johns was always ready for battle for newcastle and would train with real emphasis. Although he did take drugs, he never let it get in the way with his performances and only admitted his faults after he had retired. I remember ricky stuart once saying how highly he regarded him at blues training.

In this case Johns would get say, 50 for ability and at least 25 for attitude which would mean an overall 75. However Watts would get 30 for ability and 15 for his offield attitude problems and constantly putting himself before the team.

[The Rooster Oracle]

Research is extremely important! It's a shame that our research is very flawed when it comes to many things such as the opposition. We have the head coach from the panthers last year as our current assistant coach, so you would think that we would have very good research on the panthers and yet when we played them in round 2 at home we get convincingly beaten 18-0. And the panthers are a very ordinary side. We do not portrait a very intelligent side in the way we play our football!

[Waylander]

But then the Panthers have changed coaches (twice) since Elliotts days, so maybe they are playing a bit different now.

How does one explain Newcastle losing to the Dragons twice? Surely by your logic, Bennett, if anyone, would know how to beat the Dragons?

It's just not that simple.

[Guest]

Regarding Watts. I rejoinder with Brad Fittler.

He liked Sean Garlick's Pie a lot. So much so, he did but chow down on that pie like it was going out of fashion.

On field, he was God. Off field, his Godhead got him into mischief.

[Guest]

Regarding Watts. I rejoinder with Brad Fittler.

He liked Sean Garlick's Pie a lot. So much so, he did but chow down on that pie like it was going out of fashion.

On field, he was God. Off field, his Godhead got him into mischief.

Brad Fittler was no gentlemen , but he was no thug either. Always ready for mischief and a laugh but he would never do half the things that Watts allegedly did. As I mentioned previously attitude is not just about reflecting whether these guys are gentlemen or not but also, their level of professionalism and integrity to the club colours. I've never met a player who's been more proud of wearing our colours more than the great freddy and it still bugs me to this day the manner in which we let go of him.

[stsae]

Good points in that. However by attitude I don't just mean whether they are personally good guys or not, attitude includes things like commitment to club, consistency at training, and not putting your needs before the club and acting selfishly.

Johns was always ready for battle for newcastle and would train with real emphasis. Although he did take drugs, he never let it get in the way with his performances and only admitted his faults after he had retired. I remember ricky stuart once saying how highly he regarded him at blues training.

In this case Johns would get say, 50 for ability and at least 25 for attitude which would mean an overall 75. However Watts would get 30 for ability and 15 for his offield attitude problems and constantly putting himself before the team.

Fair enough mate.

Didn't Watts do his knee in the pre-season at training???

I'm not in any defending him but we don't know what sort of commitment he showed, cos he didn't get the chance to show us. And IMO it could be argued that he showed a high level of commitment by taking one for the team.

And the same for the off field incident, do we really know what actually went down??? While charges were alleged they weren't proven and by all reports he's still with the lady in question???

I see your point about recruitment, maybe IMO it was a bad example using Watts.

Maybe if your system was related to Both Carnteys it could/would prove more. Then again I doubt we'd have ever made the GF in 2010 without Toad and I doubt we will ever make make a GF with our Untall Cannonball. That said I'd gather their ratings that you came up with would be similar, with maybe The Untall one edging Toad out due to off field attitude???

[stsae]

Brad Fittler was no gentlemen , but he was no thug either. Always ready for mischief and a laugh but he would never do half the things that Watts allegedly did. As I mentioned previously attitude is not just about reflecting whether these guys are gentlemen or not but also, their level of professionalism and integrity to the club colours. I've never met a player who's been more proud of wearing our colours more than the great freddy and it still bugs me to this day the manner in which we let go of him.

What did we do wrong to Freddo???

His contract was finished and we informed him that we would be looking elsewhere for a coach. We also offered him a job as an assistant of some sort if he felt like taking a further role.

All this after he, as the coach, led the club to it's first spoon in over 40yrs.

I loved Freddo too but IMO we always treated him with the utmost respect and renumerated him very well for his outstanding commitment to the club. Not renewing him as a coach was a no brainer, he'd lost the respect of the playing group and failed sadly.

[chook 56]

By all accounts Freddy doesn't make too many friends at functions, either.
Have been a few reports of him behaving like a real knob to all & sundry.

[Guest]

In the NFL the personality of a potential draftee is as important as his physical talent (of course with exceptions).

We don't seem to think this way despite being burnt by dickheads time and time again. That being said I do want SBW here next season.

[Cockadoodledoo]

In the NFL the personality of a potential draftee is as important as his physical talent (of course with exceptions).

We don't seem to think this way despite being burnt by dickheads time and time again. That being said I do want SBW here next season.

Clearly with the amount of NFL players getting up to serious misdemeanors the process is just as flawed if not worse than ours..

[Guest]

In the NFL the personality of a potential draftee is as important as his physical talent (of course with exceptions).

We don't seem to think this way despite being burnt by dickheads time and time again. That being said I do want SBW here next season.

AFL as well. Doesn't guarantee no idiots but goes a way towards it.

[Cockadoodledoo]

AFL as well. Doesn't guarantee no idiots but goes a way towards it.

There are as many idiots in AFL as there are in the NRL or any other sport. The bottom line is if a player is very talented they will get a gig anyway..