I will go there....

[The Axe]

Someone said the other day, “mean what you say; just don’t say it mean”

I’ve thought poorly of Folau for his hurtful comments but he has a right to post them/say them. We are heading down the “Thought Police” scenario if not careful.
We are asking him to be more inclusive whilst we exclude him.

I would not want Folau at our club; not because of what he said, not the potential loss of sponsors; rather for two reasons he is not in our plans and we have a no dickhead policy. Desperate clubs will always look for any edge with players like Folau. Reality is Dragons cannot attract talent. Through our culture and our success, we have earned the RIGHT to reject highly talented wrong-fits.

[Jacks Fur Coat]

Someone said the other day, “mean what you say; just don’t say it mean”

I’ve thought poorly of Folau for his hurtful comments but he has a right to post them/say them. We are heading down the “Thought Police” scenario if not careful.
We are asking him to be more inclusive whilst we exclude him.

I would not want Folau at our club; not because of what he said, not the potential loss of sponsors; rather for two reasons he is not in our plans and we have a no dickhead policy. Desperate clubs will always look for any edge with players like Folau. Reality is Dragons cannot attract talent. Through our culture and our success, we have earned the RIGHT to reject highly talented wrong-fits.

I would even contest the "hurtful comments" bit though Axe, he only quoted a scripture on his instagram. Especially in a comparative context.

Anthony Mundine said a few years ago on national TV that gays should receive capital punishment as a deterrent. And that gay rights will lead to rights for paedophiles.

Payne Haas threatened to bash a policewoman last week.

Both these guys still get employment and sponsored etc.

What a crazy world we live in.

[The Skeez]

I would even contest the "hurtful comments" bit though Axe, he only quoted a scripture on his instagram. Especially in a comparative context.

Anthony Mundine said a few years ago on national TV that gays should receive capital punishment as a deterrent. And that gay rights will lead to rights for paedophiles.

Payne Haas threatened to bash a policewoman last week.

Both these guys still get employment and sponsored etc.

What a crazy world we live in.

What’s the correlation between Mundine and Folau? And why are you bringing Payne Haas back into it again? Why not bring Matt Lodge up? Or Zane Tetevano?

[The Skeez]

As a result of everything I have read, learned and experienced as a mental health worker, I long ago concluded that homosexuality is not a matter of choice. Instead, it seems quite clear to me that there is a combination of genetic and biological factors that cause people to become gay. Choice and willfulness have nothing to do with who does and does not become homosexual. Those who are gay have no more choice over their sexual preferences than those who are heterosexual.

https://www.mentalhelp.net/blogs/bei...-style-choice/

KS...This is not a peer reviewed paper and doesn’t reference any of the “evidence” quoted within...ergo, just an opinion piece.


No one is born gay, it is a taught or learnt behaviour.
From my years of study in uni (I have searched extensively for one shred of clinical evidence to suggest homosexuality is biologically inherent or familial), - to no avail, because no such evidence exists.
Homosexuality is very much “a matter of CHOICE”.
My gay colleagues will attest to this.

Your conversion therapy isn’t working, try as you might

[Jacks Fur Coat]

What’s the correlation between Mundine and Folau? And why are you bringing Payne Haas back into it again? Why not bring Matt Lodge up? Or Zane Tetevano?

Good point. Let's add them to the list. The list is almost endless.

[zac]

if folau has a right to think what he wants, the dragons also have a right to sign who they want. if they're not signing someone cos of their religious beliefs then that's bad but they have a business to run and they're entitled to make their own choice. hard to argue that they should be compelled to sign someone they don't want to sign. where's the freedom in that? if homophobes or freedom of speech campaigners don't think it's fair then they can decide if they feel strongly enough about it to boycott dragons games. ross may used to hate gays so maybe he should dump the dragons.

but one thing - it's doubtful he wasn't signed only cos of his ant-gay comments. if they'd really wanted him and folau really wanted to come they would have come to some arrangement. there very probably were other things at play here. who knows - the dragons might think he's overpriced and this might be part of a gambit to get him cheaper.

from memory folau made his comments knowing that they were against his rugby contract. if he felt strongly about it then good luck to him, but he can't then complain about repercussions. no doubt he's not the worst human being to play sport but the bad boys don't go around defending their behaviour - matt lodge wouldn't have been signed if he'd defended his right to invade people's homes. if folau made his comments as a moral crusade then he's made his point and perhaps his message will resonate with some. people who don't like homophobia are making theirs and if they think people who bash gays with the bible are out of date then good luck to them.

[King Salvo]

Have you watched the 6 part documentary 'Punk' on SBS on Demand Salvo? I'm about to start it some time this week. I still read the digital version of Mojo magazine from the UK through my library's website and also used to get Q Magazine which sadly folded last year after 34 years but I still have a collection of their great free CD's on my iPod now. My childhood neighbour who passed away at age 86 last year was one of those students who was physically forced to write with her right hand as a student even though she was left handed. I was one of the ones throwing up from the milk behind the bike sheds. I still can't stomach cold milk to this day.

Yeh i watched it when first on - Iggy Pop was on the first episode i recall - I still have some of the US Punk band records - Dead Kennedy's/ Black Flag / Hard Core Punk/Reggae - Bad Brains etc - A Jello Biafra compilation album titled "let them eat jelly beans ".

Some of the UK ones too such a UK Subs/ Cockney Rejects / Sham 69/ Subway Sect/ The Damned - The Saints "I'm Stranded" album was another early record i purchased when first released - The Cure and Siouxsie and the Banshees as well but more new wave i suppose and some PiL records too.

I remember in 1996 seeing the Sex Pistols (Original Lineup) at the Hordern Pavillion also PiL as well late 80's.- The Clash in 1982 too i think the tour was called The Magnificent Seven- 7 bucks- 7 gigs at the Capital Theatre - only went to one though

[Timmah]

Your conversion therapy isn’t working, try as you might

Lol Skeez.....
You’ve kinda misquoted me there mate...
this is my piece
KS...This is not a peer reviewed paper and doesn’t reference any of the “evidence” quoted within...ergo, just an opinion piece.


No one is born gay, it is a taught or learnt behaviour.
From my years of study in uni (I have searched extensively for one shred of clinical evidence to suggest homosexuality is biologically inherent or familial), - to no avail, because no such evidence exists.
Homosexuality is very much “a matter of CHOICE”.
My gay colleagues will attest to this.

The pro gay piece was King Salvo’s post

Go the mighty Chooks

[ism22]

Someone said the other day, “mean what you say; just don’t say it mean”

I’ve thought poorly of Folau for his hurtful comments but he has a right to post them/say them. We are heading down the “Thought Police” scenario if not careful.
We are asking him to be more inclusive whilst we exclude him.

I would not want Folau at our club; not because of what he said, not the potential loss of sponsors; rather for two reasons he is not in our plans and we have a no dickhead policy. Desperate clubs will always look for any edge with players like Folau. Reality is Dragons cannot attract talent. Through our culture and our success, we have earned the RIGHT to reject highly talented wrong-fits.

Agreed. Nobody wants a thought police scenario. However, we also don't want loudmouths refusing to back down on controversial opinions & intentionally using their status within our club as a grandstand. Holding an opinion and constantly using your status as a pro within a given league to grandstand are separate issues.

One might remember that David Pocock was given a stern warning about his environmental activism. FWIW he actually has a constitutional right (of political communication) whereas anti-discrimination legislation is not a 'right', it's a shield against discrimination.

Neither of the above are swords though! They're shields. For example the government can't make a law that shuts down the Greens and churches. You're allowed to go to church or your greenie group. However... you don't have a sword whereby you can go around being a d!ckhead then say 'I am immune from all criticism because this is a political/religious belief'.

The NRL operates within the corporate world. To be neutral... we want both coal/steel companies and (for example) Qantas//Telstra/St George (the bank) to be onboard with corporate $$$. Just like how executives within a big corporate are bound by their company's official line on anything controversial... NRL players get media training so that they can further the sport in a positive/productive way.

No player is above the game. We literally have NFI what Teddy, Tupou, Morris x 2, Manu and Suaalii think about gays and coal companies. I'm happy to keep it that way! Easts have already made the strategic decision to sign Teddy (who's probably a Roman Catholic?) It's not discrimination for us to have made that commercial decision. As noted... anti-discrimination legislation isn't a sword whereby Izzy can go around asking clubs if they're interested, then suing them when they say 'actually no... we've decided to extend Tedesco/Ponga/Papenheuzen...etc's contract instead, independently of your request'.

For those worried about his wellbeing... just like David Pocock... Izzy' doing just fine financially! You need not worry about his welfare. He's a multi-millionaire who has a job paying what, $1m a year? Nobody's banned him from working.

[King Salvo]

As a result of everything I have read, learned and experienced as a mental health worker, I long ago concluded that homosexuality is not a matter of choice. Instead, it seems quite clear to me that there is a combination of genetic and biological factors that cause people to become gay. Choice and willfulness have nothing to do with who does and does not become homosexual. Those who are gay have no more choice over their sexual preferences than those who are heterosexual.

https://www.mentalhelp.net/blogs/bei...-style-choice/

KS...This is not a peer reviewed paper and doesn’t reference any of the “evidence” quoted within...ergo, just an opinion piece.


No one is born gay, it is a taught or learnt behaviour.
From my years of study in uni (I have searched extensively for one shred of clinical evidence to suggest homosexuality is biologically inherent or familial), - to no avail, because no such evidence exists.
Homosexuality is very much “a matter of CHOICE”.
My gay colleagues will attest to this.

Not sure about that as is it something in their biological makeup or a difference in the relevant part of peoples brains that they become who they are - Transexuals become the other gender as they feel more for want of another word of being the other gender than the one they are born as.

[Mickie Lane]

Teachers would cane lefties and make them do playground duty etc to force them to write right handed when i went to school -primary- we had our share of nutty kids but a greater percentage of nutty teachers.

I remember when i was a milk monitor (the days when Schools were provided free milk ) - had to get there early to put the milk into these specially built brick units to hold the milk - I would drink a few of them as there was always more than what was needed as they were still cold- loved milk and still do.

I often said to the relevant teachers on duty for this why don't we give the milk out to the kids when they first arrive at School - oh no can't do that it has to be at play lunch ( 11 am to 11:15 am )- dumb teachers

By the time the milk was giving out it was warm and even warmer in the spring and summer months and kids were sick as a result - many brought in notes from Parents saying they can't drink the milk anymore and the whole thing fell apart and Whitlam stopped it in the end.

Don't know why Australia didn't go down the same path as the UK with free School lunches as more and more kids are attending schools not having had breakfast and no lunch.

Is that you in your milk monitoring days on the right holding your pencil in your left hand?

[Mickie Lane]

Agreed. Nobody wants a thought police scenario. However, we also don't want loudmouths refusing to back down on controversial opinions & intentionally using their status within our club as a grandstand. Holding an opinion and constantly using your status as a pro within a given league to grandstand are separate issues.

One might remember that David Pocock was given a stern warning about his environmental activism. FWIW he actually has a constitutional right (of political communication) whereas anti-discrimination legislation is not a 'right', it's a shield against discrimination.

Neither of the above are swords though! They're shields. For example the government can't make a law that shuts down the Greens and churches. You're allowed to go to church or your greenie group. However... you don't have a sword whereby you can go around being a d!ckhead then say 'I am immune from all criticism because this is a political/religious belief'.

The NRL operates within the corporate world. To be neutral... we want both coal/steel companies and (for example) Qantas//Telstra/St George (the bank) to be onboard with corporate $$$. Just like how executives within a big corporate are bound by their company's official line on anything controversial... NRL players get media training so that they can further the sport in a positive/productive way.

No player is above the game. We literally have NFI what Teddy, Tupou, Morris x 2, Manu and Suaalii think about gays and coal companies. I'm happy to keep it that way! Easts have already made the strategic decision to sign Teddy (who's probably a Roman Catholic?) It's not discrimination for us to have made that commercial decision. As noted... anti-discrimination legislation isn't a sword whereby Izzy can go around asking clubs if they're interested, then suing them when they say 'actually no... we've decided to extend Tedesco/Ponga/Papenheuzen...etc's contract instead, independently of your request'.

For those worried about his wellbeing... just like David Pocock... Izzy' doing just fine financially! You need not worry about his welfare. He's a multi-millionaire who has a job paying what, $1m a year? Nobody's banned him from working.

Thats a good read mate.

[King Salvo]

Is that you in your milk monitoring days on the right holding your pencil in your left hand?

No not me - but we did wear shorts in primary - Primary school dress was dark grey shorts(no long pants) / short sleeve blue shirt/ tie -grey with blue and yellow stripes/ Dark grey jumper with blue and yellow rings at end of sleeve and around collar /long grey socks and black school shoes - we had to bring our sports clothes to schools and change.- white tennis shoes(dunlop volleys) and short white socks- footy boots for league

High school year 7 - Long Pants cotton dark grey / long sleeve blue shirt/ School maroon and yellow tie / maroon and yellow jumper/ maroon and yellow blazer/ short dark grey socks and black school shoes - ditto sports clothes.- white tennis shoes(dunlop volleys) and short white socks to- footy boots for league

Then in year 8 and onwards it all changed- Grey Levi Jeans / Shirts could be short or long sleeve / School maroon and yellow jumper / any coloured socks and dessert boots- no tie or blazer - Girls had a new Uniform and could wear sandals with or without socks - JC sandals I think they were called.- sport clothes the same and you brought them to school and changed into them.

The only time your wore shorts in High school in my day was for sport ( boys)- Girls could only wear dresses - school or sport ones- the length of dresses was also measured- sometimes by male teachers too -

[rented tracksuit]

Someone said the other day, “mean what you say; just don’t say it mean”

I’ve thought poorly of Folau for his hurtful comments but he has a right to post them/say them. We are heading down the “Thought Police” scenario if not careful.
We are asking him to be more inclusive whilst we exclude him.

I would not want Folau at our club; not because of what he said, not the potential loss of sponsors; rather for two reasons he is not in our plans and we have a no dickhead policy. Desperate clubs will always look for any edge with players like Folau. Reality is Dragons cannot attract talent. Through our culture and our success, we have earned the RIGHT to reject highly talented wrong-fits.

No dickhead policy. Is that the same one that included Willie Mason, Martin Kennedy, Latrell Mitchel, Nate Myles, Mitch Pearce, Toddy Carney, Zane Tetvano just to name a few?

Folau stood up for his religious beliefs. Not sure why he would be excluded by the no dickead policy for doing so.

[rented tracksuit]

I would even contest the "hurtful comments" bit though Axe, he only quoted a scripture on his instagram. Especially in a comparative context.

Anthony Mundine said a few years ago on national TV that gays should receive capital punishment as a deterrent. And that gay rights will lead to rights for paedophiles.

Payne Haas threatened to bash a policewoman last week.

Both these guys still get employment and sponsored etc.

What a crazy world we live in.

Mundane can fall back on his indigenous background and his Muslim faith play the victim card so he can say what he wants and get away with it.